Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Support questions for Neutron Player only.
Lolik
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:39 am

Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by Lolik » Sat Jan 09, 2021 1:51 pm

I have a Xiaomi Mi A1 phone, it has hardware that supports 24bit 192khz audio. But when I use adb command "adb shell dumpsys media.audio_flinger" (by connecting my phone to PC in debug mode, PTP) I get only 48000... When I entered Neutron for the first time I got some "hifi something something found", but.. how do I see what the output actually is?
The reason I started thinking about this, is that when I tried Poweramp (a different music player that also supports hifi dac/amps), it says that even though my hardware supports 192khz, that is used for DSP, but then the audio is still 48khz on output (probably because of software (OS)). So my question is, does Neutron actually bypass this, can I actually achieve bit purfect for all frequencies from 44.1 to 192khz, or is the output still 48khz?

blaubär
Posts: 3312
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by blaubär » Sat Jan 09, 2021 2:20 pm

Have a look at [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices. In short : set everything in Settings > Audio Hardware to defaults ( by hitting the defaults-button in the middle below ), then invoke Settings > Audio Hardware > Frequency. If you see more than just 48 kHz then high-res-audio is supported. Choose a higher frequency and play a track. On the playing now screen in the lower right corner there's a 3-dot-button. With this button you can invoke information about the input format and the output format. Another source of information about the output frequency is the upper part of Settings > Audio Hardware.

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blaubär
Posts: 3312
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by blaubär » Sat Jan 09, 2021 2:28 pm

Whether Neutron's output circumvents Andoid's sound effects is another question - on my Samsung S9 it does when high-res-audio is activated as described above.

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blaubär
Posts: 3312
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by blaubär » Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:08 pm

... and if you really truly want to know that high- res-audio works you'll have to play a test file that contains high frequencies and check your phone's output with an oscilloscope ...


Lolik
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:39 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by Lolik » Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:48 pm

Please be patient with me as I'm trying to understand how this works.
These are my observations. If Generic Driver->Hi-Res Codec (Direct PCM) is off, then there are no frequencies available, only default, which is 48000 (OC frequency) (Bits 64 (out: 16 int)).
If Generic Driver->Hi-Res Codec (Direct PCM) is on, then there are frequencies from 44.1 to 192k (as the device supports), but when set to default all frequencies are shown as 44.1 (Bits 64 (out: 24 int)). So then I turn on Follow Source Frequency, and it does indeed start following source frequencies from 44.1 to 192khz (Bits 64 (out: 24 int)).
So what I can say, is yes, Neutron does recognize that my device supports 24/192, and does indeed process in 24 bit frequencies 44.1-192, but what is the actual output? Does Neutron go around android (which supposedly only supports 48khz on my device), or does it just give android 24/192 which is then downsampled to 16/48 and output is 16/48?

Also, an interesting thing, is that if I turn on Generic Driver->Custom Format->(Format 32-bit int, Frequency 768000), then that's what it shows me, 768khz and Bits 64 (out:32 int), even though, I can tell you as a fact, that my device does Not support 32bit/768khz, so that can in no way be the output...

I know that you can turn of DSP Effects (Device) in Neutron, that's not the question. The question is whether Neutron enables 24/192 output, or it just processes in 24/192 and then hands it over to the OS which then downsampled and outputs only 16/48?

P.s. I have files with 24bit 352khz.

Lolik
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:39 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by Lolik » Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:52 pm

blaubär wrote:
Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:40 pm
Anyway, that might well be a PowerAmp effect, see No more hi-res since update (stuck at 48 kHz)
I don't think it's a Poweramp effect, it's just that Poweramp actually shows the Output configuration, as well as decoding, resampling and dsp. Newer posts have been made and some people say it works with custom ROMs.

But the way I understand it is: no matter what player you use, android (the Rom I'm using) only gives 48khz, which, as I understand, is proved by the adb command I wrote about in first post. So I'm interested if Neutron actually goes around this, or not? If it does, then why doesn't it show when using the adb command?

blaubär
Posts: 3312
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by blaubär » Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:54 pm

So what DOES Neutron show as output ? And what frequencies does it tell you that are supported ?

blaubär
Posts: 3312
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by blaubär » Sat Jan 09, 2021 4:11 pm

... and should the problem be that the os doesn't show the frequencies that it does support then you could try to force their use with Audio Hardware > Generic Driver > Custom Format

Lolik
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:39 am

Re: Does neutron actually go around android system, or is the output resampled to android supported frequency?

Post by Lolik » Sat Jan 09, 2021 4:46 pm

blaubär wrote:
Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:54 pm
So what DOES Neutron show as output ? And what frequencies does it tell you that are supported ?
How exactly do I find that out? Is this what Neutron says is the output, or is this just the processing frequency?
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If it is what Neutron claims the output is, then how do you explain this (Custom Format):
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That's impossible for my phone, so I just assumed that that wasn't the output, but processing frequency. Does Neutron even show the Actual output?

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